Regular CAI or Short Ram ??
17-Mar-2005, 05:59 PM
#81
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 133
you will NOT fell any horsepower difference from a CAI or a SRI, how can someone fell 1- 2 hp, it's all mentally.
With fan's being used on a dyno to test an intake does not mean nothing to me. The fan's will not make enough moving air for either a CAI or SRI as driving down the 401 to be tested properly. But with the air the fan's do provide the SRI was better. With bbarbulo's straw and milkshake theory, the SRI would still better to suck in air quicker and get to the into the cylinder's faster. Which is what you want to be doing in the first place. These few degree's different from CAI or SRI will not do nothing in my opinion when sucked into the cylinder's since the temp is going to increased majorly anyway. And how much hot air do you think is in the engine bay when there is so much more cooler air being forced into the engine bay.
With fan's being used on a dyno to test an intake does not mean nothing to me. The fan's will not make enough moving air for either a CAI or SRI as driving down the 401 to be tested properly. But with the air the fan's do provide the SRI was better. With bbarbulo's straw and milkshake theory, the SRI would still better to suck in air quicker and get to the into the cylinder's faster. Which is what you want to be doing in the first place. These few degree's different from CAI or SRI will not do nothing in my opinion when sucked into the cylinder's since the temp is going to increased majorly anyway. And how much hot air do you think is in the engine bay when there is so much more cooler air being forced into the engine bay.
17-Mar-2005, 06:11 PM
#82
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 133
Originally posted by loudsubz
Who says I'm not taking it easy, its an internet forum I could give a rats behind of what goes on here, I am simply adding to the discussion with some facts rather than opinions.
I have read all of the posts, but I just fail to see how a "butt dyno" or a "feeling" makes any form of "proof" when it comes to something like this which deals with numbers.
If you read my posts I actually showed a graph, and said that with stop and go traffic you would probably feel the effects of heat soak, but when driving normally it would be the same from CAI and SRI as air is entering the engine bay and temp diff would be negligable, unless you have some super duper engine bay that is completely sealed off from the outside
I don't know why you say in your previous post:
but then reply with a:
Go figure. Show me some back to back dynos I would be lovin to see some
Regards
Your beloved Audio mod
Who says I'm not taking it easy, its an internet forum I could give a rats behind of what goes on here, I am simply adding to the discussion with some facts rather than opinions.
I have read all of the posts, but I just fail to see how a "butt dyno" or a "feeling" makes any form of "proof" when it comes to something like this which deals with numbers.
If you read my posts I actually showed a graph, and said that with stop and go traffic you would probably feel the effects of heat soak, but when driving normally it would be the same from CAI and SRI as air is entering the engine bay and temp diff would be negligable, unless you have some super duper engine bay that is completely sealed off from the outside
I don't know why you say in your previous post:
but then reply with a:
Go figure. Show me some back to back dynos I would be lovin to see some
Regards
Your beloved Audio mod
Should have refreshed the window and not gone for dinner.
pretty much said the samething.
17-Mar-2005, 11:50 PM
#83
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Scarborough
Posts: 548
"Published results never tell the whole story. During the test, we found some very interesting trends. All of the short-ram type intakes suffered dramatically from heat soak when we ran the dynos back to back. What does this mean? In the real world of stoplight-to-stoplight confrontations, performance on cars equipped with a short ram intake may begin to drop off as underhood temperatures rise." - http://www.tprmag.com/issue/1/1_intakes.shtml
In other words, go with a CAI for performance. The CAI wouldnt be affected by excessive engine heat. Most likely you wouldnt feel the HP difference between a CAI and SRI at first, but after extensive driving and when the engine bay gets really hot, then the CAI will make a difference!
In other words, go with a CAI for performance. The CAI wouldnt be affected by excessive engine heat. Most likely you wouldnt feel the HP difference between a CAI and SRI at first, but after extensive driving and when the engine bay gets really hot, then the CAI will make a difference!
18-Mar-2005, 12:22 AM
#84
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mississauga West Side
Posts: 11,206
Originally posted by Mikeye
"Published results never tell the whole story. During the test, we found some very interesting trends. All of the short-ram type intakes suffered dramatically from heat soak when we ran the dynos back to back. What does this mean? In the real world of stoplight-to-stoplight confrontations, performance on cars equipped with a short ram intake may begin to drop off as underhood temperatures rise." - http://www.tprmag.com/issue/1/1_intakes.shtml
In other words, go with a CAI for performance. The CAI wouldnt be affected by excessive engine heat. Most likely you wouldnt feel the HP difference between a CAI and SRI at first, but after extensive driving and when the engine bay gets really hot, then the CAI will make a difference!
"Published results never tell the whole story. During the test, we found some very interesting trends. All of the short-ram type intakes suffered dramatically from heat soak when we ran the dynos back to back. What does this mean? In the real world of stoplight-to-stoplight confrontations, performance on cars equipped with a short ram intake may begin to drop off as underhood temperatures rise." - http://www.tprmag.com/issue/1/1_intakes.shtml
In other words, go with a CAI for performance. The CAI wouldnt be affected by excessive engine heat. Most likely you wouldnt feel the HP difference between a CAI and SRI at first, but after extensive driving and when the engine bay gets really hot, then the CAI will make a difference!
In the real world of stoplight-to-stoplight confrontations, performance on cars equipped with a short ram intake may begin to drop off as underhood temperatures rise
It also says "May" drop off, meaning not 100%.
Even if the intake heated up a bit, and the HP did drop it would still be on the same playing field as the CAI, since most of the short rams scored 3-4 hp more than their counterparts. So if you were in stop and go for a long time and it heated up in there, (which is nowhere near as bad as having the engine heat up on a dyno, since the fans they use can never simulate 100% of the effects of driving your car outside) and the HP did drop a bit it would still be the same as the CAI was all along.
But when on the open road SRI > CAI
I mentioned someone needs to take accurate underhood temps when driving to negate the difference
18-Mar-2005, 12:30 AM
#85
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: toronto
Posts: 461
Originally posted by loudsubz
Who says I'm not taking it easy, its an internet forum I could give a rats behind of what goes on here, I am simply adding to the discussion with some facts rather than opinions.
I have read all of the posts, but I just fail to see how a "butt dyno" or a "feeling" makes any form of "proof" when it comes to something like this which deals with numbers.
If you read my posts I actually showed a graph, and said that with stop and go traffic you would probably feel the effects of heat soak, but when driving normally it would be the same from CAI and SRI as air is entering the engine bay and temp diff would be negligable, unless you have some super duper engine bay that is completely sealed off from the outside
I don't know why you say in your previous post:
but then reply with a:
Go figure. Show me some back to back dynos I would be lovin to see some
Regards
Your beloved Audio mod
Who says I'm not taking it easy, its an internet forum I could give a rats behind of what goes on here, I am simply adding to the discussion with some facts rather than opinions.
I have read all of the posts, but I just fail to see how a "butt dyno" or a "feeling" makes any form of "proof" when it comes to something like this which deals with numbers.
If you read my posts I actually showed a graph, and said that with stop and go traffic you would probably feel the effects of heat soak, but when driving normally it would be the same from CAI and SRI as air is entering the engine bay and temp diff would be negligable, unless you have some super duper engine bay that is completely sealed off from the outside
I don't know why you say in your previous post:
but then reply with a:
Go figure. Show me some back to back dynos I would be lovin to see some
Regards
Your beloved Audio mod
Anyhoo, I couldn't care less about this topic because Intakes are a waste of money. You hardly see gains for the money you spend.
EDIT: You're very picky with words aren' t you?
"It also says "May" drop off, meaning not 100%." That "may" calls for a dyno chart....
18-Mar-2005, 01:37 AM
#86
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Scarborough
Posts: 548
I agree, use stock airbox with k&n filter. Metallic alloys hold heat and takes long time to cool down. ABS plastic is the way to go! If you want a deep sound, I suggest you use a straight pipe and keep stock intake.
Better yet, if you can get a hold of an ITR stock intake! =)))
Better yet, if you can get a hold of an ITR stock intake! =)))
18-Mar-2005, 08:44 AM
#87
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Mississauga
Posts: 223
I say AEM or J's Racing... But for the most noticable diff a short arm going into a TURBO will get you the most noticable results.. Best intake Evar
18-Mar-2005, 09:15 AM
#88
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Mississauga West Side
Posts: 11,206
Originally posted by kasimmmmm
A cold air intake will obviously gives you colder air than a short ram intake because the filter on a cold air intake is not in the engine bay. It's completely away from the engine bay altogether, getting it from a spot where colder air can be found; such as the inside of a fender. And how can there possibly be a dyno to prove this? If it makes you feel better, you're rite buddy, why? because there's no dyno to prove it...
Anyhoo, I couldn't care less about this topic because Intakes are a waste of money. You hardly see gains for the money you spend.
EDIT: You're very picky with words aren' t you?
"It also says "May" drop off, meaning not 100%." That "may" calls for a dyno chart....
A cold air intake will obviously gives you colder air than a short ram intake because the filter on a cold air intake is not in the engine bay. It's completely away from the engine bay altogether, getting it from a spot where colder air can be found; such as the inside of a fender. And how can there possibly be a dyno to prove this? If it makes you feel better, you're rite buddy, why? because there's no dyno to prove it...
Anyhoo, I couldn't care less about this topic because Intakes are a waste of money. You hardly see gains for the money you spend.
EDIT: You're very picky with words aren' t you?
"It also says "May" drop off, meaning not 100%." That "may" calls for a dyno chart....
We need more debates because to many people decide they rather say something with little or no fact behind it, I'm not saying you or everyone does, just some people do. Adding a reason and maybe a mechanical view point is great, nobody ever said it was gonna be all cushy cushy in here.
As far as this whole CAI thing goes, I wouldn't suspect a big difference in air temps. I mean its a Cold Air...but its not a "air condioned cold air intake with built in freon setup delivering -20 degree air" its just slightly cooler when "no air flow" is entering the engine compartment.
Something we both agree on, for the money spent, "on some" intakes is a very big waste of money for little to no increase. But depending on the price of some intakes like the weapon R, if it could be had for $70-80, a 10hp increase at the best conditions is not bad for the money. But $250-300 for an AEM for 6-7hp is not.
18-Mar-2005, 10:01 AM
#89
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CFB Petawawa
Posts: 2,207
Aren't Mugen intake plastic or something like that?
My japanese isn't very good (white boy here) unless Mugen has a english version of there web page.
I think K&N intakes are plastic also.
My japanese isn't very good (white boy here) unless Mugen has a english version of there web page.
I think K&N intakes are plastic also.
18-Mar-2005, 10:15 AM
#90
white boy, go to mugen's US distributor's website - king motorsports.
kasimmmmm just accept that loudsubz has a very valid point backed up with pretty acceptable dyno results. the price/hp comparison is a clear blowout in favour of the Weapon R SRI. That's no doubt about that.
kasimmmmm just accept that loudsubz has a very valid point backed up with pretty acceptable dyno results. the price/hp comparison is a clear blowout in favour of the Weapon R SRI. That's no doubt about that.
18-Mar-2005, 11:21 AM
#91
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CFB Petawawa
Posts: 2,207
thanks.
I figure if I wanted to check out a Mugen Intake I should go to the Mugen site.
I think a CAI and a bigger TB would be a good combo.
Does anyone know the size of a TB on a b16a2 is?
I figure if I wanted to check out a Mugen Intake I should go to the Mugen site.
I think a CAI and a bigger TB would be a good combo.
Does anyone know the size of a TB on a b16a2 is?
18-Mar-2005, 01:21 PM
#92
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: all over Ontario
Posts: 367
Mugen intakes... now those bizzatches are costly! I'm not knocking them, though I wonder how much more power (if any) one can get from it versus a more common brand.
18-Mar-2005, 01:58 PM
#94
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: all over Ontario
Posts: 367
Fair enough. I know Mugen tests the living tar out of all of their products. I just assume get Comptech for myself for most items, since they are pretty close to OEM quality (hell, there are Acura dealerships selling their RSX superchargers, for crying out loud!) except minus the costly factor of shipping from Japan. Although I have to admit... the Mugen twin loop exhaust available for my car is flat out disgusting!
Then again, who am I to talk? I'm waiting for a set of rims to make their way across the pacific right now...
Then again, who am I to talk? I'm waiting for a set of rims to make their way across the pacific right now...
18-Mar-2005, 02:46 PM
#96
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Scarborough
Posts: 548
Yeah, cant go wrong with mugen intake. Umm...I would also highly suggest weapon r SRI.
Someone said they r $70-80, I never looked into it but if so, then definitely a steal. Ebay sells them for 120US though.
The earlier weapon r are made from ABS plastic I believe. Thus less heat and colder cold. If you can pick one up for less than $100 then go for it. If not, stock with straight pipe!
Someone said they r $70-80, I never looked into it but if so, then definitely a steal. Ebay sells them for 120US though.
The earlier weapon r are made from ABS plastic I believe. Thus less heat and colder cold. If you can pick one up for less than $100 then go for it. If not, stock with straight pipe!
18-Mar-2005, 04:19 PM
#98
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: all over Ontario
Posts: 367
Originally posted by bbarbulo
excellent choice (or should I say work
)
excellent choice (or should I say work
)
18-Mar-2005, 04:23 PM
#99
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: CFB Petawawa
Posts: 2,207
I'm looking through my copy of Superstreet 2005 Buyers guide.
In the intake section they have
Various boxes for the filter section on a SRI. eg neuspeed
Injen has heat shields for there filters
Comptech USA - Icebox
http://www.comptechusa.com
Weapon R has a CAI, SRI with storm shield, & Secret Weapon intake.
http://www.weapon-r.com
In the intake section they have
Various boxes for the filter section on a SRI. eg neuspeed
Injen has heat shields for there filters
Comptech USA - Icebox
http://www.comptechusa.com
Weapon R has a CAI, SRI with storm shield, & Secret Weapon intake.
http://www.weapon-r.com
18-Mar-2005, 08:27 PM
#100
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Deep in Durham, East side
Posts: 445
I side with the CAI. Hot air still lurks under the hood no matter how fast your going. Think im an Idiot? Well why the **** were hood vents developed then? The backward facing vents at the front of the hood are supposed to expel the air that passes throught he rad. Remember teh rad is cooling the coolant and heating the air that travel's through it. And vent's on the fender's expel hot air as well. Look at car's like the Viper. Suprise suprise. Vent's. Teh SR probably gave better Dyno #'s because the pipe is large diameter and shorter therefore increasing velocity. If running a short ram the best results woudl be to build a heat shield around it. My buddy's dad used Diamond truck bed plate on his Intrepid. He said it made a big difference. Especially right off teh line. The box is keeping out the hot engine air. Hence why stock Intake's are black ABS plastic and enclosed in a Box. To keep out the heat.CAI is still way better.
