To build or to buy?
12-Feb-2005, 06:31 PM
#1
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To build or to buy?
I'm looking to get a new car, my auto 98 is not cutting it anymore for me and I figure it would cost 5000+ for anything worth swapping plus an auto to manual conversion. I think I can get between 6000-7000 for my car plus another 2000 max to put into it, so a total budget of around 8000. I'm looking for a quick but reliable daily driver, no racing, and I have very little experience building cars but I'd like to start. I've spent alot of time searching tcc and I'm trying to avoid asking redundant questions. So does anyone have suggestions from experience? I brought it down to two choices:
1) Buy a cheap 94-01 gsr with power everything etc. (no fun building up) or a modified eg si with a swapped motor+stuff already (questionable realibility I would think)
2) Buy a mint, stock eg si hatch ($3000-4000) and swap (non turbo) but with minimal down time like around a week. Now which swap would be the best?
--h22 I've read is expensive and can have alot of potential suspension problems
--b16 looks okay cuz its cheap but kind of limited performance wise it seems, and not much torque
--b18c1 is ideal but from what I see its about 4500-5000 (is this correct?) total for a swap not leaving me with much for suspension+body mods
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
--I dont want a b20b or b18b or sohc or any other non-vtec
As I said I've spent time searching and I didn't really find definite answers so any input on prices or speaking from experience would help. I'm trying to avoid making any big mistakes and wasting tons of money. Obviously the affiliates would be a good choice for the swap but are there any other shops that are reliable or ones people should avoid? Hopefully this thread will be able to help other newbs too.
1) Buy a cheap 94-01 gsr with power everything etc. (no fun building up) or a modified eg si with a swapped motor+stuff already (questionable realibility I would think)
2) Buy a mint, stock eg si hatch ($3000-4000) and swap (non turbo) but with minimal down time like around a week. Now which swap would be the best?
--h22 I've read is expensive and can have alot of potential suspension problems
--b16 looks okay cuz its cheap but kind of limited performance wise it seems, and not much torque
--b18c1 is ideal but from what I see its about 4500-5000 (is this correct?) total for a swap not leaving me with much for suspension+body mods
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
--I dont want a b20b or b18b or sohc or any other non-vtec
As I said I've spent time searching and I didn't really find definite answers so any input on prices or speaking from experience would help. I'm trying to avoid making any big mistakes and wasting tons of money. Obviously the affiliates would be a good choice for the swap but are there any other shops that are reliable or ones people should avoid? Hopefully this thread will be able to help other newbs too.
12-Feb-2005, 06:39 PM
#2
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Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 7,745
Re: To build or to buy?
Originally posted by mugencivic
2) Buy a mint, stock eg si hatch ($3000-4000) and swap (non turbo) but with minimal down time like around a week. Now which swap would be the best?
--h22 I've read is expensive and can have alot of potential suspension problems
--b16 looks okay cuz its cheap but kind of limited performance wise it seems, and not much torque
--b18c1 is ideal but from what I see its about 4500-5000 (is this correct?) total for a swap not leaving me with much for suspension+body mods
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
--I dont want a b20b or b18b or sohc or any other non-vtec
.
2) Buy a mint, stock eg si hatch ($3000-4000) and swap (non turbo) but with minimal down time like around a week. Now which swap would be the best?
--h22 I've read is expensive and can have alot of potential suspension problems
--b16 looks okay cuz its cheap but kind of limited performance wise it seems, and not much torque
--b18c1 is ideal but from what I see its about 4500-5000 (is this correct?) total for a swap not leaving me with much for suspension+body mods
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
--I dont want a b20b or b18b or sohc or any other non-vtec
.
if i were u, id go with choice # 2, buy a stock 92-95 civic, swap in a b18c1, that motor should cost u around 3000-3500 dollars, then u just need to get it installed. Installation shouldnt cost you that much if u can find a friend or someone on the boards to do it cheaper. thats what i would do anyways
12-Feb-2005, 07:01 PM
#3
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Re: To build or to buy?
Originally posted by mugencivic
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
--b18c5 is way too expensive I think at upwards of 6000, plus I've read people beat the crap out of ITRs
13-Feb-2005, 08:11 AM
#6
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Re: To build or to buy?
Originally posted by mugencivic
1) or a modified eg si with a swapped motor+stuff already (questionable realibility I would think)
1) or a modified eg si with a swapped motor+stuff already (questionable realibility I would think)
it will be very reliable, think about it, keeping the old stock motor with 200 000 KM on it. Then putting in a new motor with 50000 km on it. How could that make things less reliable
13-Feb-2005, 03:36 PM
#8
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/\ and its heavier. Therefore has less potential.HAHAHAHHA
It looks like you've got money. Get an Integra LS and Boost it. If you've got all this money to spend don't even waste your time with Vtec. Get an LS and Boost it. You don't need vtec when you've got TORQUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! buy a Limited slip and boost a stock LS. It will be ton's of fun and will cost around the same as if you bought a Vtec and jsut bolted on some parts. And we don't have to mention what would be faster now do we................
It looks like you've got money. Get an Integra LS and Boost it. If you've got all this money to spend don't even waste your time with Vtec. Get an LS and Boost it. You don't need vtec when you've got TORQUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! buy a Limited slip and boost a stock LS. It will be ton's of fun and will cost around the same as if you bought a Vtec and jsut bolted on some parts. And we don't have to mention what would be faster now do we................
13-Feb-2005, 03:38 PM
#9
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Thanks for the input so far. I like the gsr cuz of all the power/luxury stuff but then it would leave me with nothing for performance upgrades except maybe rims if I'm lucky.
The reason I don't want a b20b is cuz I just test drove an integra with a b20 with I/H/E and it seemed to lack the top end ***** I want. I don't want a b18b cuz I have no plans to turbo so I would rather have a stock NA motor with vtec.
I question the reliability of a civic already modified because, unless you know the person you're buying it off of, you don't really know how hard its been driven and how many km's are actually on the swapped motor. However I do realize I may run into the same problems with swapping a motor myself but at least I would have a shop or supplier to back up their work rather then someone who sells me a lemon then disappears. Thats why I'm asking for people's experience with these situations to see whats the best route to go. Keep the input coming plz!
The reason I don't want a b20b is cuz I just test drove an integra with a b20 with I/H/E and it seemed to lack the top end ***** I want. I don't want a b18b cuz I have no plans to turbo so I would rather have a stock NA motor with vtec.
I question the reliability of a civic already modified because, unless you know the person you're buying it off of, you don't really know how hard its been driven and how many km's are actually on the swapped motor. However I do realize I may run into the same problems with swapping a motor myself but at least I would have a shop or supplier to back up their work rather then someone who sells me a lemon then disappears. Thats why I'm asking for people's experience with these situations to see whats the best route to go. Keep the input coming plz!
13-Feb-2005, 03:42 PM
#10
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Originally posted by mugencivic
[BThe reason I don't want a b20b is cuz I just test drove an integra with a b20 with I/H/E and it seemed to lack the top end ***** I want. [/B]
[BThe reason I don't want a b20b is cuz I just test drove an integra with a b20 with I/H/E and it seemed to lack the top end ***** I want. [/B]
15-Feb-2005, 12:01 AM
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Isn't the b20vtec a very expensive build since you need to reinforce the block?
Right now I'm leaning toward a b16a2 cuz this should leave me with some money to get full coilovers, rims, etc. Any downfall to the b16, keep in mind this car wouldn't be raced at all, I just question the torque though? Could this be bumped up at all with I/H/E or would they only contribute to top end hp? Is there a way to reliably yet significantly increase the b16's torque without major internal mods (pistons, machining, etc.)?
Right now I'm leaning toward a b16a2 cuz this should leave me with some money to get full coilovers, rims, etc. Any downfall to the b16, keep in mind this car wouldn't be raced at all, I just question the torque though? Could this be bumped up at all with I/H/E or would they only contribute to top end hp? Is there a way to reliably yet significantly increase the b16's torque without major internal mods (pistons, machining, etc.)?
15-Feb-2005, 02:47 PM
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Thats what I'm thinking that building is a lot more fun than just buying something already done, but I just question the cost cuz I don't know anyone who could do a swap for me or cut me deals on parts. Basically what I'm trying to get at with this thread: is it reasonable and worth it to buy and put together a complete eg(motor, suspension, rims, interior, exterior) with only around $8000-9000 and no hook-ups, or should I just buy something good already like a gsr or built civic?
15-Feb-2005, 03:53 PM
#16
buy a car with all the parts you want, and just take everything apart yourself, clean everything, detail and paint the engine and engine bay, do the wire tuck, and hook it all up nice a clean!! and then as the car ages, replace susp parts etc. to your own personal tastes. IMO, that's the best deal and it's still fun
16-Feb-2005, 12:34 AM
#17
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Thats actually a pretty good idea, just buy a modded civic or gsr then replace what parts you don't like with new parts and sell the old. I guess I just have to actually make the decision now on what I want to do.
16-Feb-2005, 04:01 AM
#19
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With a budget of around $8000, forget building! Stick to buying a modified car.
For example, if you pick an EG civic hatch for $3000-4000 it will have very high mileage for sure, so therefore not only will you have to swap the engine (approx. $3000) but u seriously need to consider the suspension, such as coilovers, struts, springs and many bars (approx. $1000).
that's $8000 already! And we havent even touched the exterior (such as rims, lips, lights, alarm, etc.) or the interior (such as a deck, speakers, seats, steerling wheel, shifter, etc).
In addition, there r plenty of other issues that u'll need to address. I thought I could have done up an EK hatch for about $9000, but boy was I wrong!
If u r serious about building, try saving up at least $10,000.
If you cant, i'd say u just buy a modified car.
That's just my advice, good luck!
For example, if you pick an EG civic hatch for $3000-4000 it will have very high mileage for sure, so therefore not only will you have to swap the engine (approx. $3000) but u seriously need to consider the suspension, such as coilovers, struts, springs and many bars (approx. $1000).
that's $8000 already! And we havent even touched the exterior (such as rims, lips, lights, alarm, etc.) or the interior (such as a deck, speakers, seats, steerling wheel, shifter, etc).
In addition, there r plenty of other issues that u'll need to address. I thought I could have done up an EK hatch for about $9000, but boy was I wrong!
If u r serious about building, try saving up at least $10,000.
If you cant, i'd say u just buy a modified car.
That's just my advice, good luck!
17-Feb-2005, 01:02 AM
#20
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Thanks for the input Mikeye, thats what I was thinking with all the hidden costs it probably won't be worth it. I'm looking at a GSR on the weekend so maybe I'll get lucky with that and have a little extra cash to get rims or something.
