b20 vtec?
28-Jul-2008, 12:07 AM
#1
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b20 vtec?
ok i drive a 1997 civic coupe recently just swaped a b16 in it started off alrite bit more power then my d16 but still not getting the speed iam looking for and iv heard of the b20 vtec idea havent heard much about it but really interested.... basically iam lookin for more torque without goin forced induction ... is the b20 vtec a good idea???
28-Jul-2008, 02:47 PM
#7
your's wasn't a b20vtec steve.
It was a 84mm b18c
The torque curve is different with the LS/B20 (89mm) crank than with the GSR/ITR (87.2mm) crank (from my personal experiences).
Typical very mild (all OEM parts) b20vtec usually put out around 165-180whp and 130-145ft/lbs.
Typical mild (stock block) b20vtecs with different cams and bolt-ons can make upwards of 190+whp.
Built b20vtecs (high compression, porting, cams, bolt-ons) make 200+whp all day, even the non-ported ones.
It was a 84mm b18c
The torque curve is different with the LS/B20 (89mm) crank than with the GSR/ITR (87.2mm) crank (from my personal experiences).
Typical very mild (all OEM parts) b20vtec usually put out around 165-180whp and 130-145ft/lbs.
Typical mild (stock block) b20vtecs with different cams and bolt-ons can make upwards of 190+whp.
Built b20vtecs (high compression, porting, cams, bolt-ons) make 200+whp all day, even the non-ported ones.
05-Aug-2008, 12:10 PM
#9
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iv decided to share my build plans let me know if i should change anything or add anything lookin for 200 whp
b16 head jdm second gen
b20b
new pistons rods running 11.1 compression ratio ( not sure on wat brand)
stock crank
stock block
port an polished head (mild job)
*crower double valve springs
*crower retainers
stage 2 blox cams or skunk 2 ( yet again not sure wat would work better)
blox intake manifold
*with cai
dc sports header
*skunk 2 vtec controller
upgrade fuel pump
bigger injectors
and a good tune
let me know if iam missing anything or add ,,, or i should change anything yet again iam new to this so any help would be great
* is for everything i already have
b16 head jdm second gen
b20b
new pistons rods running 11.1 compression ratio ( not sure on wat brand)
stock crank
stock block
port an polished head (mild job)
*crower double valve springs
*crower retainers
stage 2 blox cams or skunk 2 ( yet again not sure wat would work better)
blox intake manifold
*with cai
dc sports header
*skunk 2 vtec controller
upgrade fuel pump
bigger injectors
and a good tune
let me know if iam missing anything or add ,,, or i should change anything yet again iam new to this so any help would be great
* is for everything i already have
05-Aug-2008, 04:30 PM
#13
skunk2 tuner series cams are tested and proven time and time again to make great power on most 1.8L or 2L b-series vtec setups. More specifically the skunk2 stage2's.
You don't NEED to go crazy high compression to make good power, but it helps. I've tuned many sub 12:1 CR 1.8L and 2L b-sereies vtec setups that make 200whp or higher.
With 12.5:1 CR or higher there is much less room for error in both the build and tuning. You will definately hit the detonation threashold quicker than an engine with less compression, so tuning the ignition timing can be limited in some cases (from my experiences).
I'm not saying don't run really high compression, but make sure you have a reputable engine builder build your engine and have a good tuner tune it. Tuning just for WOT and max power just won't cut it on an engine like that. The partial throttle/cruise portions of the fuel/ignition maps are especially important to have tuned well to avoiding melting pistons like LEITNER did on his 13:1 CR 2L build.
You don't NEED to go crazy high compression to make good power, but it helps. I've tuned many sub 12:1 CR 1.8L and 2L b-sereies vtec setups that make 200whp or higher.
With 12.5:1 CR or higher there is much less room for error in both the build and tuning. You will definately hit the detonation threashold quicker than an engine with less compression, so tuning the ignition timing can be limited in some cases (from my experiences).
I'm not saying don't run really high compression, but make sure you have a reputable engine builder build your engine and have a good tuner tune it. Tuning just for WOT and max power just won't cut it on an engine like that. The partial throttle/cruise portions of the fuel/ignition maps are especially important to have tuned well to avoiding melting pistons like LEITNER did on his 13:1 CR 2L build.
06-Aug-2008, 01:24 PM
#14
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i was bassically want a car do do high 13s or lower is this possible for a coupe cuz i have seen semi built hatches do mid to high 13s on b20 vtec and 14.5 on just b20 motor?? also who does really good tuning?? from wat iv read zeeman does it
06-Aug-2008, 01:43 PM
#15
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Location: K-Town
Posts: 891
My friends GSR build all so had a one snap..........A lot of my SOHC buddys have had troubles with them. I'm just stating what I've seen. I never said they did'nt work good.....I would just use Skunk for there suspension and leave the cams to someone'else.
06-Aug-2008, 02:54 PM
#16
I wouldn't touch skunk2 anything BUT their cams....personally.
IMO skunk2 has better marketing than anything.
I believe skunk2 uses OEM cores for their cams (as do a lot of other companies), and i've never seen an OEM cam break. I have however seen people who think they know what they're doing try to install their cams and not torque the cam caps properly, or not set the valve lash to the proper spec or use valvetrain with too high of a spring rate/seat pressure and cause damage, but again, the majority of people don't know WTF they're doing when it comes to building engines and just toss a bunch of parts together b/c they hear thats what works.
Alot of skunk2 parts aren't up to par IMO and its all the hype on honda-tech that makes them sell so well.
IMO skunk2 has better marketing than anything.
I believe skunk2 uses OEM cores for their cams (as do a lot of other companies), and i've never seen an OEM cam break. I have however seen people who think they know what they're doing try to install their cams and not torque the cam caps properly, or not set the valve lash to the proper spec or use valvetrain with too high of a spring rate/seat pressure and cause damage, but again, the majority of people don't know WTF they're doing when it comes to building engines and just toss a bunch of parts together b/c they hear thats what works.
Alot of skunk2 parts aren't up to par IMO and its all the hype on honda-tech that makes them sell so well.
06-Aug-2008, 04:54 PM
#17
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Location: K-Town
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They have a lot of money to market to the masses. And newbs and others eat that stuff up.
My other civic is an ep3....and on the one site I visit there are a lot of complaints and buyer beware warnings of there cams.I personally have not seen it.
When it comes to cams I stick with my buddy Bisi.
Known him for a'while and his service and craftmanship is amazing. Not to mention I don't know any so called other "cam companies" that will let you call them up and talk to the guy that is going to make your cam for you....and have a one on one discusion....and get your cam custom made to your specifications.
That is simply the best service.
My sohc Bisi powered EG walks on alot of B swaps at the track.
My other civic is an ep3....and on the one site I visit there are a lot of complaints and buyer beware warnings of there cams.I personally have not seen it.
When it comes to cams I stick with my buddy Bisi.
Known him for a'while and his service and craftmanship is amazing. Not to mention I don't know any so called other "cam companies" that will let you call them up and talk to the guy that is going to make your cam for you....and have a one on one discusion....and get your cam custom made to your specifications.
That is simply the best service.
My sohc Bisi powered EG walks on alot of B swaps at the track.
06-Aug-2008, 05:48 PM
#18
How much did you spend on your "bisi" build?
I'm sure for the money you spent, a boosted setup would make double the power....but this isn't a pissin match, so it doesn't matter.
There are plenty of camshaft companies that do custom grinds.
I'm sure for the money you spent, a boosted setup would make double the power....but this isn't a pissin match, so it doesn't matter.
There are plenty of camshaft companies that do custom grinds.
06-Aug-2008, 06:58 PM
#19
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Location: K-Town
Posts: 891
I'm 32 and have never driven anything but hondas.
I've had every type of civic engine combo there is and plenty of turbo set-ups.
Currently building a D15b with a Zex stage 2 for turbo. Just like to have fun beating on buys in my sohc set-up....and if your building a high comp NA d engine you might as well use the best. Not to mention im in good with Bisi so my price was alittle cheaper then the average customer off the street.
My engine will run a high thirteen....and still hell off alot cheaper then B swap.
I know there a few companies that do custom grinds....but with Bisi you get the beat customer service plus race tested and proven track results put in'to all his products. I don't know to many companys that put as much in'to there R&D as much as Bisi. There is a reason he has a'lot of Honda records under his belt.
Money is definetly not an issue....my EG is my play car only. I have a ep3 for the DD.
Last edited by T-MacK; 06-Aug-2008 at 07:02 PM.
08-Aug-2008, 11:40 AM
#20
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Posts: 23
i have been doin some reading on honda tech and have heard storys about people messing up there motor by having the valves connect with the piston???? i only plan on doin 13 or lower compression ratio do i need to worry about this??? i plan on getting a minnor port and plolished head job with upgraded cams and valve springs and retainters any suggestions???
