SmoothOperator

ARGGG, after just posting THIS THREAD a few days ago, about thinking of selling my car, or returning it to stock, I get a BS ticket today!

Since it was raining I offered to give my girlfriend a lift to work. So I'm stuck in rush hour traffic, and low and behold, I've got an unmarked cruiser pulling me over (Queen, just east of Spadina)

Ticket #1 Unecessary noise $110
Ticket #2 Improper Muffler. $110

First of all my exhaust has TWO resonators. The reason I bought it is because of how quiet it is! It has a low end snarl to it, but isn't really loud at all! Cop says "I heard your music blaring, and that tipped me off, then I saw your exhaust, so I pulled you over."

FIRST of all I had my music turned down low, like barely audible. I don't like driving in crazy traffic with my tunes cranked. It's too distracting. SECOND, I'm only running two 8's!

Lastly I had my emissions test done 3 weeks ago! I still had the document in my glove box showing him it passed! He didn't seem to care and gave me the ticket anyways.

I'm obviously fighting the tickets. He said he'd throw the Noise ticket out if I showed him a receipt for a baffle. ****ing B.S.!!

*edit* I did a search before posting this, and noticed that a few people on here have gotten the same ticket, and have had to wait a LOOOONG time to fight in court.
Just a tip... If it takes longer than a year from when you got the ticket, you can claim that as a citizen of ontario, you have a right to a quick and speedy process. The ticket will be thrown out.

T-train

First off the unecessary noise ticket really has no merit as the HTA has no standard. The Motor Vehicle Safety Act does. the link is here ; http://www.tc.gc.ca/acts-regulations...0/mvsrv.1.html

83 dBa is rather loud.

The improper muffler is usually a crap ticket as well. Look under the section of the HTA that was referenced on your ticket and youl'll see what I mean. If you disconnect your muffler from the car, does it get louder? of course it does. Have you modified your muffler at all? No? then it is doing what it is supposed to do.
Case closed.
Just have a copy of those references on hand. Keep in mind that the Motor Vehicle Safety Act Isn't gospel on the issuing of a ticket. However.................If the HTA doesn't provide a standard for what constitutes "unecessary noise", at least you have some other reference to what your vehicle has to be at for road safety.
CHEERS and good luck.
T

T-train

Oh yeah............before anyone starts hatin on me. I'm not ragging on cops, it's just that many of them don't know the law well enough.
The time it takes to research each section of the HTA and any other references would be too time consuming if not just a little sleep inducing at best.
They're people just like us and are not infallible.
I myself am going to apply once my current Military contract expires.(Not to that Peel region either)

SmoothOperator

I e-mailed the manufacturer of my exhaust yesterday asking if they made a baffle for my model exhaust... Here's the reply I got.

"Rob
Sorry to hear of this violation ....... some thing must have climbed up that cops butt!

We do not build any baffles/resonators for that muffler, in fact I am quite surprised the cop had an issue with this exhaust. It does not jump huge in the DB levels, but rather gives the exhaust a deeper tone.
I know/and have done on other cars.....get a washer that can fit into the muffler outlet and give a couple of small tac welds. This will tone it down slightly and remove after.
Hopefully this has helped, and good luck with this bogus ticket ..... have a good one!"

marker

The fact that you may have passed an e-test 3 weeks ago means absolutely nothing as far as having a "legal exhaust" or not. A muffler, legal or otherwise, has no effect on pollutant emissions

If you have no baffles in your muffler, then it is considered a straight-through or "hollywood" muffler and that style of muffler is specifically mentioned in the HTA as being illegal.

[1sL0CiviC]

if ur court date exceeds 8 months, there ar a few forms to send out to different generals and crowns .... Charter of Rights, Section 11B.

read up on it...

SmoothOperator

Where can I get more info on this? I'd like to know which forms I send where. I've been waiting for a court date to set for some tickets I got almost 8 months ago. (2 weeks left before their times up!)

[1sL0CiviC]

Ok, first of all, you must file a "Notice of Constitutional Question" form to the Crown, The Attorney General of Ontario, and the Attorney General of Canada. This will let the court/prosecutor know that you intend to dispute the charge with a Charter Claim. But be sure you do this more than two weeks before your court date.

If your going to be mailing the forms, use registered mail ONLY!!
If you dont mail them, your motion WILL BE DENIED!

Once submitted, go to your originally scheduled court date and when you are called at court, you must immediately motion for a "Stay of Proceedings based on your Section 11B Charter Rights" and briefly give reason why you feel that your Section 11B Rights have been violated. You must make this motion before you plead guilty/not-guilty. If your motion is accepted by the JP, this will get your tickets dropped and your off the line.

If you have changed your court date without a good reason, it will definately play against you and will be much harder to convince the JP to accept your motion based. Hence, If your motion is denied, you will have to proceed to trial regulary.

Remember, if the JP is not having a good day, he can still deny your plea and continue the trial, so be ready to have a good argument and be respectful.

Sample of Notice of Constitutional Question form:

http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/DBLaws/S...4/13204Fae.gif

Want more to read? well start from page 787 on the below link:
Askov
http://www.lexum.umontreal.ca/csc-sc...kov~~x=12~~y=6

Ooh btw, its not a definate rule that 8 months is the deadline.... if the courts require alot more evidence and the time taken is probable for the case/investigation, your motion would be less favorable. ( e.g. death, DUI, blood tests etc. )

Let us know how it worked out for ya if you decide to go through this route.

Regards,
Eman

[1sL0CiviC]

Ooh, and request disclosure..... just to show them that your serious....

SmoothOperator

What exactly does this mean? lol AND, where to I get one of the "Notice of Constitutional Question" forms?

This is all a great help by the way, Thanks a million!!

*edit* oh and one more thing! How do I address the judge? Is it "your worship"? Or, "your honour"?

[1sL0CiviC]

oh god.......... i wrote a whole f%#$#@$ page and i hit refresh by accident............

will edit and continue

EDIT:

Disclosure, is all the evidence the cop has against you, you have a right to know what the cop has against you for evidence, and you can request it.

To get the disclosure forms, get it from the court house you submitted your tickets too ( check behind your icket ).

Please make sure to note that you want the officers notes and both sides of the ticket and any other relevant information in regards to your trial as needed.

Make sure you get it stamped and documented, JUST in case they fail to provide the disclousre to you in time, you can motion for the charges to be dropped due to non-disclosure and you have the proof to show that you did request disclosure.

To get the "Notice of Constitutional Question forms", the court house should have them. If not, here is another sample that you can edit.... thanks to FYST:

http://www.magma.ca/~fyst/question.htm

just change the RED text info to that of yours.

and to be on the safe side, double check the addresses on that site before you start mailing out forms, just to make sure they havent changed.... either the first link or this link is outdated.... just double check yourself.

BTW, if you call the helpline of visit the courthouse, they will help you step by step if your getting confused.

Hope this helps ....


oh, and Your Worship, or Your Honour is alright.... either way