Screech...Scribble...Screwed
Hey, I got booked yesterday in Oakville (just after a rain storm) outside a vacant plaza when my EL skidded slightly past a Stop Sign (even though I came to a complete stop, & there was no line & no sidewalk) on almost a bucket of gravel at a construction site. Got a 'Fail to Stop' charge with 'Disobey Stop Sign' scribbled above it like an afterthought. The usual (arbitrary) $110 but no pts.
It was as if the (female) cop was perched there and waiting for me. I tried my best to cry and drool but she wrote me up & took off. I came back a few minutes later & took good photos, to show the prosecutor (at 1st attendance) that the road was covered in streaks of gravel (my tires were also nearly worn, they went quick & will be replaced soon). In any case, I fight EVERYTHING, but have never had a Stop Sign infraction handed to me in the past. My philosophy is that the best way to avoid having a future conviction entered (and your driving record harmed) is to -hopefully- have every charge withdrawn, making each subsequent one, your first. Any useful, pertinent advice / information on how to move forward from this point with this charge? Much appreciated! :kiss: |
a failure to stop ticket is just that... ie. driving too fast for the conditions. it's neither arbitrary nor unfair. actually that's one of the questions on the G1 License Test. that being said, I think you still have a good shot at taking it to court and maybe having it dismissed by the prosecutor just cuz of the circumstances and the fact you did stop. but the ticket is legit, and the afterthought 'scribbling down' is a way for the officer to note for the prosecutor that you were actually gonna roll through the stop sign until you saw the cop and jammed your brakes (and hence skid). you really had no intentions of stopping till you saw the cop, did you?
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Hi, thanks, but, of course I would have (had I seen it earlier). I am not in the habit of running Stop Signs (even while turning right in a deserted parking lot). In fact, I was in the left (of 2 lanes) & visibility was obstructed by a large vehicle on my right. I just slammed harder & caused a screech when I rolled a few feet on the gravel, and -instinctively- looked right and THEN, saw the parked cruiser! :faint2:
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you kinda sound guilty to me. I would leave out that your tires are bad because it's your resopnisbility to keep your car in SAFE working order. can't afford to fix your car, then you can't afford to drive.
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Well, we'll leave the verdict to the courts.
At this point, I'm pushing the suddenly wet conditions, obstruction of visibility, and gravel spilled on the road as my main points. When I explained to the officer that I was in the process of buying new tires for my driving wheels, she threatened to cite me for driving an unsafe vehicle, so I'm fully aware of that aspect. Thanks though... anyone else have new ideas? |
On these boards, its "guilty until proven innocent" with everyone.
People assume on here since you got a ticket, you were 100% guilty of it and the cops are always right. Too many cop lovers on here. |
Originally Posted by 99CivicSiR
(Post 135352)
On these boards, its "guilty until proven innocent" with everyone.
People assume on here since you got a ticket, you were 100% guilty of it and the cops are always right. Too many cop lovers on here. driver is responsible to stop...thats what defensive driving is all about, welcome to canada expect crappy road conditions, and your tires being worn is no ones fault so you cant even use that in your statement, because as the operator of that vehicle its your responsibility to maintain your vehicle. |
Originally Posted by 99CivicSiR
(Post 135352)
On these boards, its "guilty until proven innocent" with everyone.
People assume on here since you got a ticket, you were 100% guilty of it and the cops are always right. Too many cop lovers on here. to the op: I wish you luck, I really do hope you get let off. I really do. If your innocent then I hope you don't get screwed. if your guilty I don't want my rates to go up because I drive the same kinda car as you. You want the number for a good traffic ticket agent? I've got one he's great. he helped me out when I was in the wrong to get one fine reduced and another dropped. we all make mistakes, or bad judgment calls. were human. but you really do sound like your in the wrong on this one. |
Originally Posted by TroubEL
(Post 135295)
... slightly past a Stop Sign (even though I came to a complete stop, & there was no line & no sidewalk)
There are cops out there that abuse their power, so just because he got a ticket doesnt mean he's guilty. |
OP: I like your title. Very creative. lol
On topic; I can buy the sliding on gravel but you screeched your tires. If I was the cop, it'd think you did not intend to stop until you saw me.
Originally Posted by ol Dusty
(Post 135389)
to the op: I wish you luck, I really do hope you get let off. I really do. If your innocent then I hope you don't get screwed. if your guilty I don't want my rates to go up because I drive the same kinda car as you. You want the number for a good traffic ticket agent? I've got one he's great. he helped me out when I was in the wrong to get one fine reduced and another dropped. we all make mistakes, or bad judgment calls. were human. but you really do sound like your in the wrong on this one.
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Following the feedback; taking all relevant items into consideration...
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Originally Posted by 99CivicSiR
(Post 135449)
He said that he did make a full stop, and there wasnt a line or sidewalk, its not like he got a ticket for doing a "rolling stop".
There are cops out there that abuse their power, so just because he got a ticket doesnt mean he's guilty. |
I guess what 99CivicSiR meant was simply because a ticket was issued -and I was charged with an offence- does not mean that I was convicted of an offence.
Obviously, bridging the gap between the charge for an offence; and, a conviction for an offence is for provincial court staff only. Thanks for the input so far, looking forward to reading more... |
If your tires are actually bad, replace them before the court date. Being in your receipt and say your tires where bad.
I can only see them lowering the charge for that though. |
Originally Posted by realninth
(Post 135738)
If your tires are actually bad, replace them before the court date. Being in your receipt and say your tires where bad.
I can only see them lowering the charge for that though. Do not tell them you know your tires were bad. That will only make you look ignorant. It is the vehicle operator's responsibility to keep the car mechanically safe. There was gravel on the road, and you slid further than you thought you would. |
Originally Posted by 05CivicSi
(Post 135743)
There was gravel on the road, and you slid further than you thought you would.
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Originally Posted by bbarbulo
(Post 135518)
negative. the ticket wasn't for failing to obey a stop sign, the ticket is failure to stop. they can give out tickets for that when the road is icy or covered with snow, or rear ending a car that slammed on the brakes, or whatever. it basically means you were driving too fast for the conditions. on your G1 written test there is a question that asks 'what's the most common reason for a skid?' and guess what... the answer is 'driving too fast for the conditions' (or something to that effect). so yeah, a cop doing his job is going to issue a ticket. personally i think you can fight it but don't expect too much. i got a ticket for turning left between the hours of 4:30 and 6 one time cuz a cube van coming in the opposite direction completely blocked my view of that sign, nevertheless, it was not considered relevant in court since there was a sign posted on both the right and left sides of the road (but I was looking left cuz I was turning left and didn't see the other sign). luckily for me, that's not a highway traffic act offense, it's a bylaw violation that doesn't carry anything but a fine. i know the circumstances are slightly different in your case, i'm just saying they told me ignorace is no excuse (not knowing i couldn't turn didn't change the fact that i DID turn). remember HTA isn't criminal, it's quasi-criminal, so they don't need to prove intent, just that the offense occured.
it was the only fine I've ever fought that I did't get reduced or dropped. driving related or otherwise. I skateboard so I've dealt with a few tresspassing and desrtuction of private property charges and several counts of asault. never actually threw the first blow and hence never had a charge of asault stick but that's what happens when you grow up in a small town full of bored redneck cops and even more redneck kids who think fighting is a sport and like to target skateboarders and then there parents or the redneck cops who break it up decide to press charges on the guy that walked away |
Dave you are guilty!!!!:biggrin1:
Pay up! LOL |
Originally Posted by 05CivicSi
(Post 135743)
'
Do not tell them you know your tires were bad. That will only make you look ignorant. It is the vehicle operator's responsibility to keep the car mechanically safe. There was gravel on the road, and you slid further than you thought you would. 1) Didn't plan to stop -- bad weather conditions are no excuse. As it was pointed out plenty of times, he should have been driving slower. 2) Tires are bad. Using option 2, and replacing the tires shows he owned up to his mistake. He also mentioned his tires where bad to the cop, so mind as well go with it. It's up to him though, just my humble opinion. |
^ That's good input, thanks. :thumb:
I planned to slap new rubber on Spring '09 for my front (driving) wheels (front tires have 20% tread; rears have 70%) when my rims get bolted back on for the dry/warm season. The obvious tread discrepancy is a result of replacing the rear tires (recently, with the same model) after a flat. But I suppose there's no harm in buying new tires for the front now. It was either (i) later this fall (when the rims come off); or, (ii) early spring (when they go back on) & if now carries with it the benefit of a receipt in hand to show the prosecutor & help my case, perhaps it's the better alternative. Anything else? :ranger: Cheers... |
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