tommygunnz

i meant to put this in the other thread but its closed.....

Will there be any emmisions issues with ANY aftermarket intake manifold systems..?

"speed racer", "obx", etc....

they seem to be of a different design... these are all d-series

can they really increase an additional "10- 15hp"..?

bbarbulo

iTrader: (2)

you won't likely see 15 hp gains w/o other mods and tuning. 15 hp is a huge gain when talking about a d series. and no, as long as the manifold has the appropriate sensor ports i don't see why you'd have issues with emissions.

Nova_Dust

Will not affect emmission if all the sensors/plugs go where they suppose to.

pizdek

You have a d series engine? I am thinking of getting a skunk 2 intake Mani. and a 70mm throtle body.. does any body know of the power increase if any? On a B16?

T-MacK

Pn a mostly stock B16 a 70mm tb combo will bog really nice.
You'll end up looseing power.

pizdek

no way i would loose power? why is that? with a nice skun2 mani? should i go with a smaller throtle boddy like a 68mm?

T-MacK

Sorry but a 70mm TBon a basically stock motor will loose a lot of bottom end power.
Its not like you throw on a huge TB and IM and all of a sudden you get some huge increase in HP. That size is meant for built up engines from the ground up.

pizdek

thats realy crappy news. thanks i have been looking and cant seem to find anyone that will agree with you though. every honda site that i go to ppl get power increase with a intake.

bbarbulo

iTrader: (2)

i agree with that, you lose velocity with too big of a throttle body or incorrect intake manifold. the manifold is supposed to match the flow capacities of the head and the volumetric efficiency of the combustion chambers.

search 'volumetric efficiency internal combustion' if you wanna get a better understanding. additionally, for manifold design and so on, look into fluid dynamic texts for what happens to flow velocity as you increase bore while maintaining volume.

T-MacK

Well there wrong.
If you throw that big of a TB on a stock engine, it is useless!!!!..Bottom line.
If you want real HP gains, why not throw on some cams and pistons then a tune!.....That will be money well spent.
Bottom line I could careless what you do its your car and money,waste it how you feel!

screwface

the short answer is yes (assuming you're still talking about your d15b)

while the average dohc begin losing power at 7-8000 rpm and continue to lose power beyond that due to the parasitic loss caused by the extra cam, the sohc engine will conceivably continue making power until it's impeded by a bottleneck or the stress forces the internals to cease remaining internal.

although the d15b uses a z6 head, i have heard more than once that the stock valvetrain can support 9000 rpm without any valve float (i guess that's an assumption made under trial and error) and only begins it's a ascent to the true potential nearing the stock redline of 7200rpm. if you look at the parts list on d-series.org, you'll also notice that the valvetrain components are unique to this engine despite the head being a z6 head.... indicating the higher flow capacity of this engine.

given also that vtec engagement on the d15b is a fair bit higher than on the average vtec engine, it seems altogether rational to assume that the more flow the engine can get the more power it will continue to make beyond 6000 rpm.

T-MacK

To funny....Show me proof a stock d15b will make 10 to 15 whp from just a IM and oversized TB. Please I don't think so.
And FYI...vtec for sohc was strictly designed for fuel economy. Dohc is a totally different story.

Nova_Dust

I wouldn't even touch throttle body unless you are doing head work, which includes cams and whatnot. More air coming in means you need the fuel to support that, and also require the cams to keep the valves open a bit longer to get the extra air/fuel mixture in there.

You can buy it, and install everything once you are ready for the work. That's what I did anyway.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

a stock b-series throttle body would be better suited for a d-series IMO. A stock b16/GSR throttle body is 60mm, the d-series is like 55mm or so if you're lucky, a 70mm throttle body is overkill, bigtime. I prolly wouldn't even use that on a boosted d-series. 70mm is 2.75 inches, i only have 2.5" charge pipe on my boosted b16, so my 64mm throttle body is pretty much all i'd really benefit from, which happens to be the exact size of the bored out b16 throttle body i'm using.
I'll attest to loosing torque from a bigger throttle body.
I made 113ft/lbs with a stock b16 intake manifold and throttle body. After a 64mm throttle body and AEBS intake manifold it made 111ft/lbs, but it made more whp and the power carried out to 8500rpms. With the stock intake manifold (IM) and throttle body (t/b) it made less peak whp and the power started dropping off at 7500rpms.
This was on an engine with headwork and stage 2 cams and not very much time on the dyno. So you can bet you'll loose torque and low end whp with a 70mm t/b....even with a skunk2 IM. Just b/c your engine has the capability to deliver more air (with the bolt-on mods) doesn't mean the cam/piston/bore/stroke combo necessarily is going to benefit from it, or will even be capable of sucking in more air and making more power.
Tuning has a lot to do with this though, if you're changing how much air, and how it enters the engine, you need to change (by tuning) the amount of fuel that is being delivered AND when the spark is fired (ignition timing). Without tuning, gains from upgrades like this and even a cam(s) can be small and not worth the money really IMO.
While not really effecting emissions, the power output won't be effected much either. If you ask me, an IM and t/b are something you upgrade after doing a bunch of work to the engine (its not really as easy as slapping in some pistons and cams, there is a lot of stuff that goes along with that).

tommygunnz

WOW! thanks alot for the info and opinions guys, i hope you know you've set youselves up for a bunch more questions....

The map sensor and tps sensor on my throttle body were busted so i (cuz the mech sed i shud) used my old IM... which was my real reason for asking the original question seeing that as long as is wasnt a bad thing i'd go with the b series TB..

Seeing that i still have the z6 manifold i was thinking about porting it and the tb(if applicable) and then putting it on...

Will i be able to use these sensors from my y7 IM(intake manifold) or if any problems with the bseries TB???

And am i lead to understand that a ported or aftermarket IM is not recomended if i havent done head work?




And my last question is.. how will the ported IM compare to and aftermarket???

bbarbulo

iTrader: (2)

there are only a handful of sensors that Honda uses, so most sensors from diff't models interchange (usually w/in the same OBD type). even if you can't use one sensor off the Y7, you'll be able to easily get it off another Honda (the IACV is the only one that pops into mind as being different).

you will get the best gains if you also engage in headwork, but a properly ported manifold should also net you some gains. it's all about reducing pumping loss and increasing volumetric efficiency - reduce restrictions and you will see hp increase.

an aftermarket IM is just a waste of money IMO, cuz they're just an off the shelf item built with tradeoffs in mind. a real custom manifold would be ideal, but that's big $. especially since you're not going too wild on your build (cam, ported head, big valves, reshaped CC), a very mildly ported stock IM should outperform a wild aftermarket unit. that being said, it really depends on who ports it. any idiot with a diegrinder can port stuff, but in reality it's a fine art that requires a flow bench and many years of experience. usually porting wins/loses races for professional teams since their specs are so tight.

FPMotorsports

You will NOT PASS E-TEST with a Skunk2 Manifold!
I speak from personal experience.....
Skunk2 Manifold does not have all the sensors etc like a stock mani.
Note : it says not CARB legal....

Also with the tb question u have to be openminded.
I had a stock b16a1 with a gs-R tranny, stock cams, adj. gears, i/h/e 2.3" cat back, blox mani and a 76mm tb making 160whp and 105 wtq.
It made peak power all the way to redline... if the redline was increased im sure it would have made more power.
Now im on a new head ITR with jun III's.... and full valvetrain... still using the same mani/tb. Havent got it fully tunned yet though will post a vid of dyno / track, dyno graph and time slips once done.

Also with the D series not gaining 15whp....
Ummm my $800 header did more then that! Actually added 17whp... with a aem Cold air intake and a ractive air filter lol....
The manifold...added me about 15whp but that was with further tunning, match tb, zex 59-300 cam and springs/retainers, and a cat back... so how much will the manifold alone add? Maybe 2-4 peak whp. It does have a nice sound though LoL... Kinda spools lol....

kingjames1983

I hate to tell you but you are wrong. lol
I have a b16 with a built head, skunk2 intake mani which has been ported and port matched with a 68 mm TB and I passed etest without my car being tuned running fairly rich. Now that its tuned I know I would pass with flying colours.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

I've personally built a tuned a fully built b16 with GT35R that was using a skunk2 intake manifold and throttle body and it passed a legit etest.

T-MacK

Tons of people have passed e-tests with Skunk2 IM.....Myself included.
And obviously your car made a'lot more power with a $800 header(which one by the way beacause I believe you if its a Bisi or SMSP) CAI, Zex cam, and tuning.
But not just from the TB??