RApiDArTiFAcTs

Hey All,

Well the story goes, I had a head gasket replacement in March of this year, and now 6000 km's later I come to find out that there is still coolant leaking into my cylinders. Which means that either the head gasket is fouled or there is a crack in the head that was missed. I doubt there is a crack in the head, b/c it was sent out to be inspected and machined. But this is what the guy who did my work is trying to tell me.

I was told by a mechanic friend of mine that on certain vehicles your not supposed to reuse the old head bolts (95 civic is one), which this guy did, and also that your not supposed to use that tacky spray on head gaskets which this guy also did. So this could be the problem

Now I've already approached the guy who did the job and gave him the benefit of the doubt, but he doesnt seem like he is willing to rectify the problem fairly, instead he tried to convince me to buy a used motor and have him put it in with a small break on the labour.

So my question is what do you think a fair resolution to this problem would be? I would say a refund of all or part of what I paid him, only b/c I dont want him under my hood again.

I think this is fair.

Thanks in advance for any input.

DefconDave

To be honest, it doesn't really sound like your mechanic has done anything wrong. Maybe, the head was not torqued down proplerly, may be he didn't follow the proper precedures, or may be it was not prepared properly by the machine shop. It is also possible that you have a cracked sleeve, or head. Has this motor been disassembled and diagnosed?

As for "tacky spray" I've never seen a problem using it on headgaskets.

And yes, the oem Honda head bolts should be replaced since they are torque to yield. Were you given the option to change
them?

chris_si98

6000km is a long time, I doubt you'll get anything from the mechanic. Using coppyer spray is fine, re-using the old head studs have been done (not recommended). Maybe he didn't check the deck of the block and it was warped, maybe the head was re-surfaced improperly, a lot of things could of caused your hg to blow again. Nevertheless unless there was warranty specified I doubt he'll be doing anything for free.. especially after 6k

Mr. Death

A general rule of thumb is too NEVER re-use headgaskets and head bolts. Anyhow I think it would be fair if he did the job over again at no cost to you except for your parts list and this time have your head resurfaced or it will leak again.

RApiDArTiFAcTs

He did reuse the head bolts and never gave me an option to purchase new ones. The head was checked and resurfaced. If there was a crack it the head, doesn't that stem back to the gasket leaking?

My friend said most gaskets come with a paper that says not to use any type of adhesive, that could affect the torque.

It's been leaking since the day he did it, b/c I noticed it misfiring, and took it back to him. He said he didn't know what was causing that, and told me to take it, drive it for a while and see what happens.

chris_si98

you should of been on his *** from day one then if it was never done right.

Cynikal.Mindset

if u arent satisfied with the service performed when u get the car back you gotta take it back and get it fixed right then, not 6000km down the road...not to mention you cant even warranty a leaking headgasket without proof of using new headbolts...for your own sake check the torque on your headbolts yourself and see if they are even torqued to any degree the same accross the head

1sloweg

Ive reused headbolts numerous amounts of time, sounds to me like he did nothing wrong. Take it to him, let him diagnose it, if its his fault he should fix it, if its not your going to pay. Simple as that.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

i've reused head bolts many times with no problems as well. I've also used the copper gasket spray with no issues (even on high whp boosted engines).
Pull the valve cover off and torque the bolts down again. Its really easy to do on a D-series.
If the head comes off again, make sure to resurface the head and check the clearance on the block (in a few places) with a flat edge and feeler guage....shouldn't be much more than .003" or so. If it is, decking the block would be a good idea (and at this point, you really would be better off getting a newer engine and swapping it in). If the block is within spec and the heads freshly resurfaced, get an OEM headgasket and new head bolts (or ARPs for a little bit more), now would also be a good time to change the timing belt and water pump (if it hasn't been done recently).

Did your car overheat prior to the headgasket change? If so how bad/often? Does its still over heat?

red90dx

Well I am hoping its the D series, because B's are $$$ to replace$$$


If not why not just grab a z6 or y8 head and mini-me the motor?

either way like Zeeman said you will have to strip it down in the end and rebuild back up....and buying a used engine could have the same problems too, then your back on the line and sinker for the labour charges.

RApiDArTiFAcTs

I did point out the misfire the day I picked it up, and he couldnt diagnose it, and just told me to take it and drive it for a bit. During that time, I've had 3 people try and diagnose it but no one could figure it out.

Until recently I haven't had any time off work to take it into Honda. They diagnosed it, said I have low compression on cyl # 2, pulled my spark plugs (white/brown colour) and told me to take it back to the mech who did the job b/c coolant i still leaking in, causing it to misfire. So obviously the job wasn't done right, either at the machine shop end or the mechanic's end.

It's also never overheated, I've seen the gauge at 3/4's but that was it(one time).

With a mini me swap I would need a new ecu right?

imported_starboy869

I think your tech is just some joe that changes parts. A tech that can't diagnose a miss fire? WTF!?

Who are the other three people? Just friends?

Now Honda found low compression in cylinder #2, and white/brown colour spark plug tip. Any tech that knows what he's doing can find all that out within 10 minutes of starting to diagnose an engine. Now zip ahead to 30 minutes. A leak down test will help pin point where the problem area is. ie. cracked head or headgasket.

I would try retorquing the head bolts. Just *MAYBE* they're lose around #2 cylinder and you can get away with a simple cheap fix.

BTW: FIND A NEW TECH.

dingus888

so you over heated the **** outta yoru engine after having a badly ppoped head gasket for thousands of kms'

you are stupid enough to actually keep yoru bottom end with high ks and actually have the head gasket replaced

your deack on your block is probobly warped not allowing the headgasket to seal or you sleeve is crack (probobly)

leakdown test to see where the problem is

your mechanic takes yoru machined head and slaps it on the block like you asked him to do probobly for real cheap so what is the problem here...? he wants you to get a new motor cause yours is probobly on it's last legs

torque your head and get a leak down

RApiDArTiFAcTs

The three people were; the mech who did the job, zeeman (andrew), and friend of mine who's a mechanic at mazda.

I really hope its just the headbolts.

dingus - it was close to overheating before I had the gasket done and its only got 175,000 kms on it

The problem is it's still leaking.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

i didn't change any parts, offered my advice and couldn't find the problem....not much of a misfire though. He said he changed his plugs a few km ago, we tried a set of new plug wires, dizzy cap and rotor (that i had, and took back off his car) and it still did the same. We ran out of time, and i offered my help at a later date, but he never made arrangements to come back. But having a small coolant leak (never brought to my attention) could definately foul a spark plug. I even offered to try swapping out the injectors, but like i said, he never came back. So

RApiDArTiFAcTs

I called you back a few times, and left a msg on your cell and at ur your home, we made arrangements for the thursday and it wasnt a good time b/c of rain then you said the sunday for sure. You didn't return any msg's when I called to confirm. So I just thought you weren't interested or didn't have any time.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

That sunday i spent in the hospital and didn't have my cell. But i don't know why i wouldn't have called you back if you left me a message (sorry mang).
I'm always willing to help out, if you don't mind driving out to the hammer.
Are you still having that random little shake problem now? Or are you just concerned with the headgasket problem?

RApiDArTiFAcTs

It's all good man.

Ya that shake problem is the engine misfiring, so it's all related.
When I get the HG situation resolved it should take care of the misfire too.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

Check your spark plugs, see if any of them are white, you can change spark plugs t'ill you're blue in the face, but if coolant is getting into the cylinder is going to make the spark plug go white and possibly foul.
I wouldn't go back to the last guy who did your headgasket, but have the next guy check the block for cracks and resurface the head and check it for cracks, use a OEM headgasket and new head bolts. Do you know if the mechanic used a OEM gasket or a felpro single layer? I've had problems with the felpro single layers before not sealing the greatest, but never had any issues with OEM metal gaskets.
After the headgasket change, get some new plugs (from CT or partsource b/c they're only like $7 for a pack of 2 vs hondas $8/each, and they're the same NGK v-power plugs)

RApiDArTiFAcTs

Ya the plugs are a white/brown colour... so for sure coolant is getting in. He used a Felpro gasket ( i heard to be one of the best tho). I have to check how much an OEM gasket goes for.