A Variation on "Will these tires fit?"
10-Oct-2003, 11:58 AM
#1
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A Variation on "Will these tires fit?"
I'm currently in the process of messing around with my Civic, as I'm sure many others in this forum are. I've run into what I think will require either a little bit of ingenuity or a whole lot of cash or both. I bought a set of tires that are far too big for a Civic, mainly because tires that are far too big for a Civic look really good on one. I'm currently riding my 2000 Si on 215/45/17's ( Yoko Avid H4's). With a stock suspension and no fender mods the car only rubs slightly in corners when I hit a bump.
Now comes the tricky part. I want to keep that tire size and lower my car. I'm going with H&R Sports so the drop is, if I'm not mistaken, about 1.5 in the front and 1.25 in the back. This is definitely going to tuck my rear tires. Now it comes down to suspension geometry. Will the negative camber push the top of the tire in enough so that fender rolling will take care of rubbing in the back?
The front is also a concern for me as the extra drop is going to put my front tires a lot closer to that liner. Will the increased spring rate cut the travel enough. Essentially the tire is 1" in diameter larger than stock and with a 1.5" drop thats like a 2"+ drop. Add to that the 15mm of extra width that the tire has on either side and there is potential for problems. So lets say the clearance is reduced by the equivalent of a 2.5" drop. Has anyone riding at that height had problems with their front fenders/liners?
Any opinions or thoughts are welcome. I also realize that the easiest solution to this is 205/40/17's but that just doesn't seem like enough of a challenge.
Thanks in advance for your time.
Now comes the tricky part. I want to keep that tire size and lower my car. I'm going with H&R Sports so the drop is, if I'm not mistaken, about 1.5 in the front and 1.25 in the back. This is definitely going to tuck my rear tires. Now it comes down to suspension geometry. Will the negative camber push the top of the tire in enough so that fender rolling will take care of rubbing in the back?
The front is also a concern for me as the extra drop is going to put my front tires a lot closer to that liner. Will the increased spring rate cut the travel enough. Essentially the tire is 1" in diameter larger than stock and with a 1.5" drop thats like a 2"+ drop. Add to that the 15mm of extra width that the tire has on either side and there is potential for problems. So lets say the clearance is reduced by the equivalent of a 2.5" drop. Has anyone riding at that height had problems with their front fenders/liners?
Any opinions or thoughts are welcome. I also realize that the easiest solution to this is 205/40/17's but that just doesn't seem like enough of a challenge.
Thanks in advance for your time.
10-Oct-2003, 12:09 PM
#2
one thing you fail to mention is the offset of your rims.
off the top of my head, not knowing what your actual offset is, I will say you are looking for more trouble than is worth. To answer some of your questions, the camber will NOT make up for the extra 15 mm in width. I barely have 2-3 mm of clearance under flex on 205 Azenis (fatter than normal 205) in the rear, and I ride much harder springs than you. In addition you are forgetting the front wheels are also turning side to side... that puts your inner fender liner, as well as upper fender lip AND inner framerail all at risk. Where does it currently rub when cornering??
On another note, it IS possible to do it, cause there are many (too many IMO) Civics on 18s that are dropped (and the smallest tire available for an 18 is 215/35/18 which STILL physically smaller than your tire). However these cars NEVER get really truly DRIVEN.... given that these cars have problems, and the tire is SMALLER than what you have, you are very much out of options. It won't work.
off the top of my head, not knowing what your actual offset is, I will say you are looking for more trouble than is worth. To answer some of your questions, the camber will NOT make up for the extra 15 mm in width. I barely have 2-3 mm of clearance under flex on 205 Azenis (fatter than normal 205) in the rear, and I ride much harder springs than you. In addition you are forgetting the front wheels are also turning side to side... that puts your inner fender liner, as well as upper fender lip AND inner framerail all at risk. Where does it currently rub when cornering??
On another note, it IS possible to do it, cause there are many (too many IMO) Civics on 18s that are dropped (and the smallest tire available for an 18 is 215/35/18 which STILL physically smaller than your tire). However these cars NEVER get really truly DRIVEN.... given that these cars have problems, and the tire is SMALLER than what you have, you are very much out of options. It won't work.
10-Oct-2003, 02:14 PM
#3
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Thanks for the reply. The offset is 40. As for rubbing I get only slight rear rubbing on medium hard corners with a bump in middle. The front doesn't currently touch except for serious obstacles that are driven over too fast or really hard turns, again there has to be a bump for the rubber to brush the liner. As far as touching the inner framerail it only touches under 95+% lock conditions and its the front of the tire that rubs.
Keep in mind too that my current running condition is dead stock, i.e. no fender mods. I plan to roll/cut the rears assuming I can find someone to do it professionally ( Louisville Slugger Free ). I'm also planning on poking around in the front. Thinking of stretching my liner out with a heat gun and possibly getting the fenders flared. I;m also not on a time frame, I'll sell the tires over the winter if I can't fit them. Any ideas regarding things I could do to make it work?
Keep in mind too that my current running condition is dead stock, i.e. no fender mods. I plan to roll/cut the rears assuming I can find someone to do it professionally ( Louisville Slugger Free ). I'm also planning on poking around in the front. Thinking of stretching my liner out with a heat gun and possibly getting the fenders flared. I;m also not on a time frame, I'll sell the tires over the winter if I can't fit them. Any ideas regarding things I could do to make it work?
10-Oct-2003, 03:37 PM
#4
the offset is perfect, more or less.... you will NOT be able to fit these tires in there w/o serious massage of the fender area, which quite frankly is pure abuse. There is plenty of traction to be had from normal sized tires...
this mod is NOT bbarbulo approved
this mod is NOT bbarbulo approved
10-Oct-2003, 04:03 PM
#5
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Well thanks for the input, I've read your posts before and you are pretty knowledgeable. I'm still going to give it the old college try though simply because the tires look so damn badass. I'm definitely going to put the car down on the big wheels, if only for a picture. Theres a guy I have to talk to in waterloo who races with 225's on a 92 hatch thats lower than I'm planning on going so if he can give me a reasonable plan of action I'll try it out. Other than I'll put 205/40's on next year.
10-Oct-2003, 04:11 PM
#6
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Originally posted by kane2k
Well thanks for the input, I've read your posts before and you are pretty knowledgeable. I'm still going to give it the old college try though simply because the tires look so damn badass. I'm definitely going to put the car down on the big wheels, if only for a picture. Theres a guy I have to talk to in waterloo who races with 225's on a 92 hatch thats lower than I'm planning on going so if he can give me a reasonable plan of action I'll try it out. Other than I'll put 205/40's on next year.
Well thanks for the input, I've read your posts before and you are pretty knowledgeable. I'm still going to give it the old college try though simply because the tires look so damn badass. I'm definitely going to put the car down on the big wheels, if only for a picture. Theres a guy I have to talk to in waterloo who races with 225's on a 92 hatch thats lower than I'm planning on going so if he can give me a reasonable plan of action I'll try it out. Other than I'll put 205/40's on next year.
10-Oct-2003, 04:28 PM
#7
nothin wrong with trying 
I totally HACKED my inner fenderwell on 205/50/15s and the wrong offset rims. 
it was my first set of rims many many years ago, and my first drop as well. there were just shreds of the inner liner left. I replaced the liner, and bought rims that actually FIT the car, and it all worked out well. Live and learn I say! 
I'm just worried that you will catch the fender with the tire in a sharp turn and you'll get yourself about $300 worth of body work to go with the new set of tires you'll need 
I totally HACKED my inner fenderwell on 205/50/15s and the wrong offset rims. it was my first set of rims many many years ago, and my first drop as well. there were just shreds of the inner liner left. I replaced the liner, and bought rims that actually FIT the car, and it all worked out well. Live and learn I say! I'm just worried that you will catch the fender with the tire in a sharp turn and you'll get yourself about $300 worth of body work to go with the new set of tires you'll need
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