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Turbo guys - is an Intercooler just an intercooler... question?

Old 13-May-2006, 11:12 AM
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Question Turbo guys - is an Intercooler just an intercooler... question?

hey guys here is the question,

now that ive made my mind and shopping around..
the question is: Is an intercooler just a intercooler or is there something i should be looking out for?

i seen deals on Ebay, im trying to get on Johnnyracecar.com but there website has been down since March..

im doing a budget build - with the help of my buddies id like to know what to look out for???

welds?? contruction??? cuz as far as im concerned its just a heat exchanger... cooling the intake charge...

i seen deals with the SSautochrome intercooler - but i went on HT to do a search and they say its CRAP, i also seen some intercoolers made by Taika autoparts in Cali.... i think thats what the name is....

any help would be greatful!
Mark
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Old 13-May-2006, 11:40 AM
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Construction makes a huge difference.
These deals you see on ebay are just ****ty material. Not only that but most of them are tube and fin which heat soaks sooner then a given bar and plate design.
I would either go with a spearco or precision core. I used to have a bookmark which explained intercoolers very well.

Also remember, just cause its bigger doesn't mean it's best for your set-up. Alot of people think bigger intercoolers mean more power which is not true. If your i/c is too big, throttle response will suffer and low end power will suffer. You should really do some research, there are so many if's, and's or but's when selecting an intercooler for your turbo set-up.
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Old 13-May-2006, 11:50 AM
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^^ agreed. There are many different IC's out there and diff. sizes. It's hard to pick one. I read up on IC's a while back so some of what I remember might be wrong but an IC with more rows is better than longer rows. An IC's cooling is done at the first 50% of the cooler. And like dominik stated.. bigger or longer coolers can result in lag if you don't have enough charged air to fill it up quickly. And obviously don't get an ic that is "thick".. because obviously the thinner the more it can cool down.

Johnnyracecar makes cheap decent coolers, precision makes better ones and spearco makes real good ones.

To be honest.. i know a few guys running ssac coolers.. they havent really complained about it, but I wouldn't get one, they are poorly designed. Most people will say "meh an intercooler is an intercooler". I'm not one of those people. Every part of your setup.. even though you are on a budget, should be a good part. Don't cheap out. I cheaped out.. and I regret more than anything now.
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Old 13-May-2006, 12:02 PM
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wel Aaron just pointed out to me Street imports...
they sell intercoolers fairly good prices and he has delt with them before b/c of his Rad.

believe me guys im looking and reading everynight on Homemadeturbo etc... to the point of no sleep...

i am aware of the bigger the cooler the more Lag problems.
and yes the cooliong charge happens within 20% of your cooler..
am i going crazy?? i think not... just want to enjoy life... and spend money where it will keep me smiling forever...
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Old 13-May-2006, 01:46 PM
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in intercooler is not just an intercooler. Keep in mind that you can get it modified to work best with your setup (i.e. the end tanks customized)
I have a brand new one, that was only mounted on the car before being replaced with an even larger one. PM me for more info.
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Old 13-May-2006, 02:46 PM
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I would look into the Megan Racing Intercooler. It's bar and plate, and comes in a small and large size. Although I have the small and its quite big lol. They look pretty well constructed, and for a price of around $300, its basically a steal.
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Old 13-May-2006, 03:25 PM
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well i found one...

my setup is going to work with my AC.. my buddy is currently building a manifold for me, wtih DP and Charge piping..

i think im going with a 16G for my setup. using Crome for tuning and we'll see how this goes... gonna run external wastegate...

i know im missing things but ill message those to help out..
if you know Chlanman sponsored by Teknotik he will be helping out with the build and whoever wants to learn...

my car will be the guinea pig!!
damn i cant wait...
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Old 13-May-2006, 03:42 PM
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read this:

http://www.are.com.au/feat/techtalk/intecoolersMR.htm

if you run shorter charge pipes, you can perhaps run a larger intercooler as there will be less "volume" to be filled with the shorter piping.
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Old 14-May-2006, 11:51 AM
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YES 16G! My favourite MHI turbo. Are you going with small, big or evo3? A 16G can make 330WHP on a DSM. I ran one in my Colt and LOVED it.

Also, where do you plan on mounting this intercooler? Depending on what car you're boosting, some bumper hacking may be necessary.

You don't need a external wastegate on that turbo. Just get the upgraded flapper. My buddy ran a upgraded flapper on his 20G and boost 24psi in his DSM daily. Had no boost creep or spiking issues. The only reason he went to external recently is because he got a deal on a manifold with tap for external wastegate and he's upgrading to a GT35R.

If you're i/c is to big it can even hurt top end power because the turbo just can't keep up with charging the pipes and it will run out of steam.

As for the megan racing i/c's, my buddy runs one in his 240SX, the problem with a civic is I can see it being to tall. 1/4 of it hidden on my friends 240sx. For the 16G I'd go with something 24*8*3 with 2.5 in/out. I don't know if you guys remember that Mirage that was in import racer, when he had 16g and that sized i/c he put down 320ishWHP.

If you want, I can give a link for DIY alcohol injection. I also have DIY alcohol injection based on load of the motor....
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Old 14-May-2006, 12:38 PM
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hahaha yes a mhi evo3 can make 300 plus on a dsm but it falls flat on it's face after 6000 rpm....not to mention has creep problems holding low boost

not to mention this is at 25 psi and on race gas

something bigger would be better for a b series

16g would be good for a d though

just get a nice quality intercooler not ebay garbage

prob won't need a gnarly one like I have seen on some dsms

I mean if your not making huge power and runnign low boost

look into dejon tool
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Old 14-May-2006, 12:51 PM
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^
The dingus is back.... Nice to see some more knowledge return.
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Old 14-May-2006, 01:15 PM
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yes, you definately don't want a 16g on a b-series. That turbo is way to small. It will spool quick, but like dingus said it will run out of breath quick. I would say use nothing smaller than a T3, even that will be a little small. Lots of people use t3/t4 hybrids, which are good b/c they use the small exhaust side of the t3 (to spool up quick), but a larger cold side to flow good up top
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Old 14-May-2006, 01:46 PM
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^^ i wouldn't listen to andrew's advice.. he doesn't even know the wrench method


lol.. but in all seriousness, on a B.. I wouldn't get a small turbo (14b, t25, 16g, t3) t3/t4 is a good choice, so are a few ball bearing turbos that will be more expensive ( gt28rs, gr27,etc)
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Old 14-May-2006, 01:54 PM
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well what about a Turbo from a Saab or Volvo??

with a .57 trim <-- thats what i was looking for originally.
Turbo's are hard to find...

thanks to those who are shedding some light on this issue...
you guys are rockin....

yeah i got alot of work ahead of me...
this is going into my SIR ) B16A2
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Old 14-May-2006, 03:31 PM
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Originally posted by chris_si98
^^ i wouldn't listen to andrew's advice.. he doesn't even know the wrench method


lol.. but in all seriousness, on a B.. I wouldn't get a small turbo (14b, t25, 16g, t3) t3/t4 is a good choice, so are a few ball bearing turbos that will be more expensive ( gt28rs, gr27,etc)
Sorry i don't know your ghetto ways of workin on cars.
I wouldn't listen to chris_98si....he doesn't know how to not spin a bearing after 2 weeks of driving with his turbo setup on.



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Old 14-May-2006, 03:51 PM
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hey guys back on topic - this was the intercooler i was gonna run..

http://www.streetimports.com/test/products.asp?catid=95

tell me what u guys think!
Mark

is this too small?? if i go either with a 16G or T3?

its the middle intercooler.... 18"x6"x2.5"
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Old 14-May-2006, 06:34 PM
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looks wise 18" is too small imo. I would get 24x7x2 or 3.

edit:

atleast when I spend 2000$ i get torque, unlike some torqueless people
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Old 14-May-2006, 10:42 PM
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hey this is what i fouind on EBAY - is this too good to be true??

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/GREDD...00188976QQrdZ1

greddy kit??? for 420 usd

cut and paste link..
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Old 15-May-2006, 12:57 AM
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Greedy intercoolers SUCK. They're tube and fin design. Complete junk. As suggested earlier by myself, either spearco or precision.

As for turbo, if you're wanting to make 300ishwhp, go with a .57 trim. Ball bearing or not, although most of the hybrid turbo's these days are ball bearing.

Just remember, turbo cars depend on they're tune. It's all about tuning. If it's not tuned, and your EGT runs wild you'll melt a piston and say bye bye to the motor. That or you just simply wont make the power you should.

Select a turbo first then select the i/c. Your intercooler should accomodate your turbo, not the other way around.

Also, dont go by size, ask the seller for a CFM rating. End tank design also matters, if you want side-to-side or top-to-bottom. Like stated your i/c all depends on the turbo.

As for the DSM with the ridiculous i/c's. Most of those guys upgrade to a 20G or bigger. Dsm'er's build their cars differently. They're starting with a turbo platform. Most of the smart ones get all the supporting mods first, then upgrade the turbo.


If you're looking for a turbo, don't limit yourself to EBAY. Go on ************ or .com w/e, ca.dsm.org and other forums.
I was looking at a t3/t4 57trim on the ******** site a few weeks back but passed cause the owner didn't seem to know much about the turbo.
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Old 15-May-2006, 01:30 AM
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hey Dominik - i really appreciate the help, ive been searching alot for deals on misc. stuff - obviously like any owner, you want the best for your car, ive read up the 16G as well, now i know this would be fun for streetabilty wise, but ive searched on it and noticed since my car revs high 8200, it might fall flat on its face, whereas DSM owners are shifting at 7000rpms i believe...correct me if im wrong

yeah i wont limit myself on EBAY - i think thats what gave me a headache all day....

as for Turbo's ive been searching for the best model - now i know there is a whole wack of different brands its hard to distinguish whats good and whats not... i guess anyone can slap housings together and slap there name on it, but is the function the same? the quality etc...

like i said i dont want to spend big bucks.... but at the same time im not cheaping out either, i was looking for a budget build that will give me that Ooommmph.. when i need it..
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