How well does the New Si handle compared to the DC2R?
02-Apr-2006, 08:57 PM
#25
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Originally posted by Xscorpio
rsx version is called DC5 Michael, DC2s are integra type
rsx version is called DC5 Michael, DC2s are integra type
02-Apr-2006, 08:59 PM
#26
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Originally posted by kwasley
1st i hope your not talking about the type r
i bet you couldent.
gsr motor<TYPE R MOTOR
gsr tranny << TYPE R TRANNY
and if your talking about the new si, which has more whp and tq than the rsx-s then i bet your gsr motor/tranny coudlent take it either.
LSD OWNS YOU!!!
1st i hope your not talking about the type r
i bet you couldent.
gsr motor<TYPE R MOTOR
gsr tranny << TYPE R TRANNY
and if your talking about the new si, which has more whp and tq than the rsx-s then i bet your gsr motor/tranny coudlent take it either.
LSD OWNS YOU!!!
sarcasm is key....
08-Jun-2006, 01:38 PM
#28
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Location: Honda
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I know this is an old thread but I wanted to put in my $0.02.
I am one of the few people who has driven a JDM Type R (1996 model in Japan...when I lived there) and a 2006 Civic Si. I have also driven a 2002 RSX-S back to back with a 2001 GSR and also 2006 Si back to back with a 2000 Civic SiR.
First about the "facts". The horsepower ratings can not be compared side by side 195 (ITR) vs. 197 (Si). With the newer SAE ratings, that Honda is going by, the old 195 is probably closer to 185 now. To give an example the 2005 Odyssey had 255 hp (non SAE) and the 2006 version has 244 (SAE). There is no change in engine just the way it was tested. With that being said, Power: advantage Si.
Weight, I won't dispute that. Weight: advantage ITR. However, believe it or not, most buyers (regardless of if it was in Japan or Canada) added A/C and better stereo so, the advantage is less...
Transmission: both with LSD but Si has 6 speeds. Tranny: advantage Si.
Body structure: advantage Si. The body on the 7th gen was stiffer than the DC2 and the 8th gen is that much more. With a stiffer structure, it is easier to tune the suspension.
Suspension: advange Si. On paper the double wishbones look better than the strut on the Si but since the body structure is stiffer on the Si, the suspension can actually do a better job. With that being said, in terms of 'tuning', the DC2 suspension is easier but if the structure isn't great to start with...no amount of suspension tuning can make up for that.
And finally getting to the original question:
I would say the Si handles better than a DC2R. If you were going all out on a race track comparing a race ready DC2R vs. a stock Si, the DC2R might be faster but if you are comparing a stock Si, with a DC2R how it is normally equipped for street use, the Si would be the better car.
I personally, haven't driven an Si back to back with a DC2R however, with my experince with RSX-S vs. DC2 GSR (also Si vs. EM1), there was a big difference. I felt the GSR was a good car in it's time but the RSX was superior and the RSX is based of the 7th gen Civic. No one will argue the 8th gen Civic handles better than the 7th gen. If you think about it, DC2 first came out in 1993, the new Si came out in 2005. A lot has happened and improved in 12 years.
People tend to want to keep good memories but I bet if anyone were to drive these cars side by side, they would understand what I mean. Just like how the old muscle cars of the '60s were considered fast...I bet a new Si would be able to take most of them....but that's another can of worms...
I am one of the few people who has driven a JDM Type R (1996 model in Japan...when I lived there) and a 2006 Civic Si. I have also driven a 2002 RSX-S back to back with a 2001 GSR and also 2006 Si back to back with a 2000 Civic SiR.
First about the "facts". The horsepower ratings can not be compared side by side 195 (ITR) vs. 197 (Si). With the newer SAE ratings, that Honda is going by, the old 195 is probably closer to 185 now. To give an example the 2005 Odyssey had 255 hp (non SAE) and the 2006 version has 244 (SAE). There is no change in engine just the way it was tested. With that being said, Power: advantage Si.
Weight, I won't dispute that. Weight: advantage ITR. However, believe it or not, most buyers (regardless of if it was in Japan or Canada) added A/C and better stereo so, the advantage is less...
Transmission: both with LSD but Si has 6 speeds. Tranny: advantage Si.
Body structure: advantage Si. The body on the 7th gen was stiffer than the DC2 and the 8th gen is that much more. With a stiffer structure, it is easier to tune the suspension.
Suspension: advange Si. On paper the double wishbones look better than the strut on the Si but since the body structure is stiffer on the Si, the suspension can actually do a better job. With that being said, in terms of 'tuning', the DC2 suspension is easier but if the structure isn't great to start with...no amount of suspension tuning can make up for that.
And finally getting to the original question:
I would say the Si handles better than a DC2R. If you were going all out on a race track comparing a race ready DC2R vs. a stock Si, the DC2R might be faster but if you are comparing a stock Si, with a DC2R how it is normally equipped for street use, the Si would be the better car.
I personally, haven't driven an Si back to back with a DC2R however, with my experince with RSX-S vs. DC2 GSR (also Si vs. EM1), there was a big difference. I felt the GSR was a good car in it's time but the RSX was superior and the RSX is based of the 7th gen Civic. No one will argue the 8th gen Civic handles better than the 7th gen. If you think about it, DC2 first came out in 1993, the new Si came out in 2005. A lot has happened and improved in 12 years.
People tend to want to keep good memories but I bet if anyone were to drive these cars side by side, they would understand what I mean. Just like how the old muscle cars of the '60s were considered fast...I bet a new Si would be able to take most of them....but that's another can of worms...
08-Jun-2006, 03:12 PM
#29
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Location: Mississauga, Ontario
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you claim that you've driven the type r but made no comments on how the type r compares to the rsx. you compared a gsr to a rsx which is completely different because the type r had several places that was reinforced.
i watched a video where they raced a dc2r against a dc5r and the only advantage the dc5r had over the dc2 was on the straight due to the stronger engine. they compared corner entry speed and exit speed and the dc2 performed better than the dc5 did. now i'm not making a claim saying that the 8th gen si has a stiffer and better chassis than the dc2 but the dc2 had a stiffer chassis than the dc5. it simply performed better in the corners and if you watched the video you could see it. they tested the cars on the tsukuba circuit.
i watched a video where they raced a dc2r against a dc5r and the only advantage the dc5r had over the dc2 was on the straight due to the stronger engine. they compared corner entry speed and exit speed and the dc2 performed better than the dc5 did. now i'm not making a claim saying that the 8th gen si has a stiffer and better chassis than the dc2 but the dc2 had a stiffer chassis than the dc5. it simply performed better in the corners and if you watched the video you could see it. they tested the cars on the tsukuba circuit.
08-Jun-2006, 03:26 PM
#30
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Location: Mississauga, Ontario
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i found a video on the dc2r vs dc5r but it's not the one i've watched before. this is kinda off because it's debatable wheither the dc2rs are more heavily tuned or not.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7J42WQfaWF4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2Btr-QYUdw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7J42WQfaWF4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2Btr-QYUdw
11-Jun-2006, 01:53 AM
#31
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Originally posted by Team Rukus
lol this question should even be posted.
we are talking about a track ready car compared to a fast grocery getter.
edit: what you also have to remember is that all production R models where made with one thing in mind TRACK/RACE that being said they arent even the same as the other trims in the same bodyshape.
lol this question should even be posted.
we are talking about a track ready car compared to a fast grocery getter.
edit: what you also have to remember is that all production R models where made with one thing in mind TRACK/RACE that being said they arent even the same as the other trims in the same bodyshape.
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