four2theizz0

Hey guys, I'm pretty new on here as you can tell. i've done some looking around and am wondering what everybody's opinion is. I have a d16y8 in my 2000 si. I am obviously looking for some more power. I've read a lot about SOHC's and was originally going to do a swap, no question. i finally got a ride in my buddy's supercharged BMW. HOLY *#%$, that thing rules!!!
now I KNOW a D16T will be nowhere near that(and don't expect it), he's just been teaching me about turbos/supers, and I am getting a little swayed towards the darkside.
i also am about to take a ride in another buddy's 00integra with an LS/vtec to feel that, because that is my other option(or b20/ VTEC)

this is a daily driver and i want more power(tq as well), but also reliability. I just want to know what direction anybody reccommends.

any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.

thanks!

imported_mugenpowered

IMO,
Turbo and reliablility don't usually go together even when its a stock set-up let alone putting a turbo on an engine that didnt come with one.
If I were you I would look into a b16, (a b16b engine would be sick).

Mr. Death

Go turbo, you will NOT be disapointed. With a good tune it will be as reliable as any stock turbo car.

imported_alwaysoverkill

d-series.org or even better my man, turbod16.com

Basically from what I read, you can get 180-200fwhp and 150-160wtq out of a D16 with little effort but some tuning. Over 200whp, you better have good tuning, but it can still be done.

Safe boost seems to be 7-9PSI, over that many people recommend ARP head studs, etc...but its all there. research, especially on turbod16.com and you'll see lots.

A b16 is only 160-168 (usdm or jdm) and the B18C1 is only 170, thats crap for $3500-$4000 swap (im talking installed with everything you need). 170hp is only around 150fwhp and still gutless when you consider torque which would be crap, like 110wtq if that. but it is reliable (should be) because its a stock OEM supposed to be low milage engine (they all claim 50-60K).

Turbo required fuel (larger injectors, fuel management, etc) but can give way more power reliably if tuned right. Since you said daily driver, i'd go for 180fwhp which is more then a B18C5 or H22A and torque in the 140-150wtq which again is more then B18C5 (Integra Type R) or H22A (prelude). If you get greedy and crank the boost so you get like 220fwhp on stock, you'd gernade the engine most likely unless you've tuned it to run that higher psi..

anyways, those sites should help ya out

imported_SaYjAiBaO

you're comparing all motor vs. boost. obviously you'll be getting more torque out of it. the potential of a B series is far superior to a d. you want torque? pick up a B18B for cheap and boost it, you'll get pretty good numbers and won't have to worry as much as say boosting a B20. or dump in a H22. you're car will be dd so you won't have to worry about the sacrificing handling as much.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

if i knew as much about turbo's and how reliable a boosted car CAN be i think i would have boosted my d16z6 over swapping in a b16 (like i did). The initial cost of the swap is the same as boosting the d-series reliably would be. And what i've spent building my b16 could've been spent on building another d16z6 for boost and would yeild much more power, especially torque than my b16 does, with the same total amount being spent.
But i was so ignorant to boost, scared a little even b/c its my daily driver.
If you wanna do a b-series swap go crvtec or even just a b20 with a b16 tranny.

chris_si98

I'm also facing the same dilemna.

Basically, from what I researched I have learned this..

If you boost, you will have to maintain it more, so if you have a habit of not maintaining your engine, then don't boost. Also, a boosted engine can be safe and reliable for a daily driver if you tune it properly. Don't spring the $2000-$3000 for a greddy turbo kit, I recommend you attempt to build your own custom turbo, it is much cheaper that way, and you will save a lot of money to possibly build up your engine. Also, my friend told me greddy makes crappy downpipes (i don't know if this is true)

On the other hand you can pay around the same price for a full b16a2 swap with install, and have a tq-less engine and only 160hp. But the potential of a b-series engine is much more greater than a D. You could also frankenstein your swap. There are so many roads you can take.

Anyways, do some research, talk to some guys who have boosted their d-series engines/ have swapped the engine you are looking to purchase.

Goodluck with whatever road you decide to choose.

imported_kIeRaN

both are rughly the same in cost, but i would go turbo just because boost is more fun

czeto

N/A all the way. If you are citing reliability as your goal, all motor is thw way to go.

scarlemthug

really it all depends on your budget, if you like getting your hands dirty and how well you maintain the car currently. Also think about how long your gonna have the car and whether you plan on selling it later on or not. a D turbo is nice and if you get the right parts and have it tuned properly with uberdata/hondata/neptune/crome etc it will last you a long time. But also another thing to consider is the cost of gas. Pretty much as soon as you even think about turbo your looking at atleast 91 maybe even 94octane depending on your power goals etc. with the cost of gas right now i would make sure your gonna be able to afford the gas because once u turbo ur gonna wanna stomp on it ALL THE TIME. You may think you can control yourself but boost is addictive. If you think you can afford the gas etc then i say go for it, take your time researching and piecing **** together. If you cant afford it then grab yourself a straight B18b1 swap and if you can get a GSR tranny and run with that. With the b1 swap you run 87 octane, have a good torque curve and powerband and its definitely quick enough for a DD. If you do find yourself wanting more boosting a B18b1 is a possibility and you can pull some sick numbers outta them if tuned properly.

four2theizz0

hey guys

thanks for the great suggestions! keep the votes coming!
FI was runnign away but now NA is catchign up. you guys have been some great help.

overkill: thanks for the great writeup it was prety informative, ive looked on those forums and learned from them as well, i was just wondering what ppls preferences were on here, especially for driving in Toronto. like how ppl say that manual is pointless if you live downtown, although im in scarghetto, so its not as busy here and you can open it up.

most of you tend to prefer the boost i see. thats cool. like i said i am really starting to like it. when i first got the car, i really wanted to stay NA. but after actually being in a boosted car, even one thats wayyyyy faster than mine would be, i know it would be sweet in mine. i guess i should come to a meet to see a D with a turbo eh?

yes, cost is a concern. i would like to keep it down asmuch as possible. but other than maintenance and initial cost of the kit and some better parts, what other upkeep/upgrades will i need with boost?
with a swap, ill want to keep modding everything
with boost, i should be happy once its in
this is just an assumption.

and chris_si
when you say acustom turbo, do you mean part it altogether separately? instead of just a kit? or is it somethng more complicated and advanced than that?


so basically, more maintenance but more fun with turbo?
and less maintenace but more reliability with swap?
i knwo you all said with good tuning boost will be fine, its just that i live in a townhouse and dont really have a place to work on the car myself. i do some work when i take it to a friends house. i just cant regularly do it myself. dont worry im not gonna ask about shops to tune because i know i can look them up.


one more thing i forgot to mention is that i already have 100000kms on the engine, and will be doing this around the time when ill have 110,000 and 120,000 on it(which wont be long at all). im guesing turbo shortens the life on an engine, will it be too pointless to boost an engine that old already?


and scarlemthug, great point abuot the gas prices. definently something to consider. mi only asking this because you said that i could get away with 91 depending on my power goals. this may be a stupid question but would i get away with 89 if i was boosting only like 5-7psi. or is 91 no question once you have boost?
im just curious

thanks and keep the votes coming!

Mr. Death

You'll need at least 91 octane to keep your engine from detonating. 87 or 89 octane = blown motor.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

well it sounds to me that you'd be better suited with a N/A car.
Go with a b20 w/b16 or gsr tranny. Simple, straight forward swap with great potential for either boost or a vtec head.

imported_alwaysoverkill

yup, atleast 91 with boost, i'd run no less the 94 sunoco personally, cause if it detonates, its gotta be $$$

a compression test of your current engine would likely be a good area to start as well as a leakdown test. it will tell you how its holding up so far. ideally, you'd have pretty equal compression across all four cylinders with 10psi of each other.

zeeman

iTrader: (1)

thats the nice thing about the ls/b20....you can still use 87 octane. But realistically, using premium doesn't cost that much more than regular. Its only $0.10/litre more than regular and on 40L its only $4 more.

scarlemthug

yeah you will definitely need to run 91, 94 is a bit overkill for 5-7psi on a D series. Most of the guys in the states i believe can only get access to 91 at the pumps, lucky few even get 93 so were pretty lucky up here to have 94 but i doubt you would need to use it if you keep your setup pretty simple.

When people say do a custom turbo kit they basically mean shop around, find the best prices on good parts and do it like that because for the most part "turbo kits" have some good parts and other parts that arent so great and alot of them tend to use FMU's.

Id say a B18b1/gsr tranny would be perfect, you can get the swap for fairly cheap and later on turbo it and with 10psi you should be in the 240-250whp range with proper tuning.

Either way id go with a setup like this:
-log manifold
-T3 Super 60 Turbo internally gated
-greddy type-rs BOV
-hondata/uberdata/crome/neptune
-440cc injectors
-2.5-3"downpipe and full exhaust
-2-2.5" IC piping
-JRC intercooler (6inch)
and all the miscenlaneous fittings, gaskets and other parts that you will need to get her going.

If your not looking for crazy numbers keep it simple and shop around and you should be able to put a nice kit together. One thing to think about though is that most tuning shops are like $500+ with you providing the tuning hardware/software.

chris_si98

looks like scarlem thug pretty much covered it by what i meant by custom turbo kit. What it means is instead of purchasing a 2-3grand greddy kit, you can shop around and purchase each piece individually and it will end up being cheaper than purchasing the kit, so with the money you safe, you can safely tune your engine.

But I read your post, and it seems like you would prefer a NA motor. Like I said, boosted motors need a lot of care. NA don't really need that much maintence.

If money is an issue do what zeeman said, but if you want do blow 3-4 grand, purchase a b18c1, install it and then later on add on some bolt-ons, and you'll have a pretty quick vehicle that put a big hole in your pocket.

Goodluck with w/e you decide to do.

imported_Scar96

if u wanna see or get more info on d series turbo...pm bbarbulo....he has d16y7 i think boosted and is gettin around 300whp....talk to him and he could help u out more

Mr. Death

300 WHP. Holy ****e thats impressive!! Can you say torque steer!

scarlemthug

obviously have no idea wht your talking about but ok lol.